Donald Campbell's restored Bluebird in museum home row

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quicksilver-wsr
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Re: Donald Campbell's restored Bluebird in museum home row

Post by quicksilver-wsr » Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:05 am

There's no criticism from me of the questions arising from your original post, Mark.

But it's the timing that's wrong - in that the BBP have been massively committed elsewhere to something that is central to the whole project: namely, running the boat to prove that the restoration was successful in delivering the stated aim of producing an authentic, running, machine.

Crew training aside, of course.

Nigel

Ernie Lazenby

Re: Donald Campbell's restored Bluebird in museum home row

Post by Ernie Lazenby » Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:44 am

In due time I am sure Bill or Mike will offer thoughts to the issues raised in this thread which for the most part has remained to the point. Until then I don't think there's much wrong in general considerations being aired;

To understand how things can go wrong one only needs to read the history of the Flying Scotsman locomotive and how it bankrupted individuals who wrongly believed taking it around the world would create mass interest, it didn't and it took a trust being formed to save it for the nation.

For those who dont understand company law; currently the four people named in control of the Bluebird project in company house records only have a limited liability in law if the project got into financial diffdiculty. That liability is the sum of £10 - 'A company limited by guarantee' That protects them from being personally liable for any debts incurred by the project. The last time I looked the records submitted show the project had £31,000 but that was before Bute and is probably a lot less now. The point being that any thoughts about taking it abroad etc cannot be sensibly considered with such a low working capital.
As time quickly passes by and all the recent publicity becomes a distant memory sponsorship will dry up, thats the nature of these things.
The Ruskin museum is a trust similar to the trust owning and running the Flying scotsman and thats a different thing to a company limited by guarantee.

Most people who have followed the story believed K7 was going to be housed permanently in the Ruskin. Gina has added to the confusion by saying different things in the last decade or so not least quite recently in terms of the length of the time the project has been running when she said she did not want to see it running possibly having another accident. Gina opened the new annex at the Ruskin thus showing full support to the premises being K7's home. Last week Bill appeared on TV spoke very well but raised questions when he said K7 was a living thing and needed to be run, referring to the museum he said yest it could be there between 'gigs' I think that means demonstrations runs but where?

If K7 goes into the Ruskin and needs to brought out to go wherever then that starts to become a major financial consideration and the money has to come from somewhere. Its easy for those of us who have an interest in the story to get carried away thinking the whole world is interested because the reality is it isn't and after the recent publicity has passed away into history interest will become less and less, that's the way of things today.

Stored for ever at the Ruskin and maybe taken out onto Coniston water each year for a run would not be an overly significant financial burdon and could be supported by well wishes like me. I would be prepared to pay for the fuel! That of course depends upon getting permission from the LDNP authority which could be a problem.

One final point of interest is how much is K7 insured for?

Just some thoughts from an old guy who has no axe to grind. Back in early days Bill asked me if I wanted to get involved in the re-build but I declined due to my health problems which since then have become a significant problem to me and my very tolerant good lady wife(married for 49 years) I would have ended up a burden to the excellent team that evolved.. I was granted permission to photograph and measure the wreck in detail for my model making project and had a number of requests from an individual for copies of the photos etc. I had promised Bill I would not make them public or let anyone have copies and I have kept my word.

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Richie
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Re: Donald Campbell's restored Bluebird in museum home row

Post by Richie » Fri Aug 17, 2018 12:16 pm

It will all come out in the wash, it always does....

except choccy sauce, choccy sauce yields no nothing !


and on that note a big shout out to our sponsor "Chemetall" for supplying a fantastic sealant !
Clarence come out ov zat tank at vonz !

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Richie
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Re: Donald Campbell's restored Bluebird in museum home row

Post by Richie » Fri Aug 17, 2018 1:28 pm

Richie wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 12:16 pm
It will all come out in the wash, it always does....

except choccy sauce, choccy sauce yields to nothing !


and on that note a big shout out to our sponsor "Chemetall" for supplying a fantastic sealant !
Clarence come out ov zat tank at vonz !

Malcolm Ops
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Re: Donald Campbell's restored Bluebird in museum home row

Post by Malcolm Ops » Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:50 pm

Not only should we, the crew, wait until we have recovered from a straight 14 days of operating the craft but I think we need to call a meeting during which the c**p on faceb*****ks can be reviewed (if any of it is any use) :lol: :lol: and we can determine how the project can move forward to show the craft to a wider world audience. Should that mean that the Coniston Water byelaw for a Proving Trial is never used, so be it, I am no longer precious about it existing. I forgot who used the phrase but ‘bloody waste of time’ sprung to my mind but it does not bother me when I have worked amongst positive people in the BB on Bute Crew. :) :D
Malcolm Ops

Derby, England

Ernie Lazenby

Re: Donald Campbell's restored Bluebird in museum home row

Post by Ernie Lazenby » Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:42 pm

With great respect if the last post is indicative of the general view of the LDNPA its perhaps not surprising an impasse appears to have occurred. Anyone from the LDNPA reading it could be forgiven for getting a little annoyed. Intemperate language rarely achieves anything; type of language used by the crowd rather than an operations manager hoping to move things forward. Seems going to Coniston to run may not happen. Sad.
BTW Do you operate/communicate on project matters as Malcolm Pittwood managing director of Spee3D PLC or as plain Malcolm Pittwood ops to the project- Just curious. The former carries more weight.

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Richie
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Re: Donald Campbell's restored Bluebird in museum home row

Post by Richie » Fri Aug 17, 2018 7:55 pm

Ernie, I know you are desperate for answers buddy, but please give us a chance to get our heads back on... it’s akin to coming home arms full of shopping and being ambushed by the family, questions, requests et al :D as a father yourself you know the feeling.

Just give the guys a few days matey
Clarence come out ov zat tank at vonz !

Ernie Lazenby

Re: Donald Campbell's restored Bluebird in museum home row

Post by Ernie Lazenby » Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:36 pm

Okay no problem. Quite willing to wait a couple of days or so. (I have had a similar PM request from Mike)
Last edited by Ernie Lazenby on Sat Aug 18, 2018 12:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

CHWk7
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Re: Donald Campbell's restored Bluebird in museum home row

Post by CHWk7 » Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:46 pm

Gentleman,

We should all be at this point in time celebrating this magnificent achievement by Bill Smith and his team and not having a negative discussion on the possible future. The fact that the boat worked straight out of the box so to speak blows me away and then some, unbelievable really! Enjoy the present while you can as the for the future it will take care of itself!

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Renegadenemo
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Re: Donald Campbell's restored Bluebird in museum home row

Post by Renegadenemo » Sun Aug 19, 2018 1:16 pm

Ahhh, back to normality - that was knackering!

I'll try to keep this brief without leaving anything out.

Yes, K7 worked straight out of the box. She floated, started then went like a bat out of Hell when asked to. One or two bits fell off, leaked, worked loose or behaved differently to how we expected but the maintenance crew were across the issues and our drivers did an amazing job.

Then Gina got a look at her father's boat floating in the sunlight and declared at once that there was no way that boat could be stuffed in a museum, the doors closed behind her and that's that. She had to be shown off to a global audience. We had people lined up on the causeway in the hope of tasting the kerosene flavoured spray as Bluebird roared off and you won't get that in the Ruskin.

Now then, I have been telling the museum for many years that this living machine could not just sit as it would deteriorate. Build her to run and the price you pay is having to tend her systems until the end of time. There has never been any argument over making her run but on the several occasions I have asked the museum et al for their thoughts on future running and anti-det measures all I've had is deafening silence. There appears to be an element that would happily shut the door behind her and that would do for them. That has never been an option and this has been on record for many years.
I have also stated categorically that we won't take our fifteen years of damned hard work and determination anywhere near the museum until this matter is fully resolved and contracts signed so if the slightest hint of wibble emerges that we are being unfair in any way remember that they have had at least a decade to get it sorted.

Same goes for any plans to run on Coniston. For ten years they have known what was going to happen yet when push came to shove there's nothing in place. Bute did it in seven months. I keep hearing that they couldn't plan without a firm date but that's a cop-out and a weak attempt to shove the blame back to our side of the table. They have comprehensive plans for their next flood or mountain rescue but no date for that either - just remember that. They keep saying they've offered dates and we've not accepted them. I am not about to ask a sponsor to throw their money on the table to sit out two weeks of crap weather in October when kids and families can't get there.
We have told them for years - two weeks in a month without an R in it when the kids are off school, but doesn't seem to be going in.

Then there's the LDNPA - We're not even going to begin on that one except say that until they organise unrestricted running during daylight hours in a month without an R when the schools are out we'll likely ignore them.
One of the more ridiculous things I've heard is that we'd have to pack up at 4.00pm.
On Loch Fad we often had to wait until quite late in the day for the right conditions, especially in the first week when we did our high speed runs - and all runs on Coniston would be high speed over a much longer course so we need everything spot-on. We had parents sit with their kids all day, often through rain showers and squalls. On several occasions I raided our catering tent for apples and snacks to feed kids who hadn't expected so long a wait, but wait they did and mostly they were rewarded with the sight of Bluebird roaring down the loch. There is no way on Earth we are going to sit all day waiting patiently for good conditions just to have it drop flat at 4.30 only to have to send all those patient people home empty handed because some p**s-pot bureaucrat is scared of Mrs. Miggins whining about a jet engine running at tea time. We didn't have any such crap on Bute and we won't put up with it anywhere else. The people of Bute moved their livestock so the show could go on.

So - in a nutshell.

Bute was a massive success and is now our benchmark for any future running. Coniston, LDNPA, sort out the same sort of venue and we will turn up and play your gig. I'm sure the powers that be on Bute will be glad to show you what's needed.
Gina wants her father's boat toured and that is an excellent idea that has massive support from pretty much every quarter so we'll do that.
The museum can store the boat and display her when she's not being shown off or in maintenance so the sooner they get their proposals on the table the sooner that can move forward.

In the meantime, we have a LOT of work to do on the boat to get her into proper shape to do that again. There's water in places we didn't know she had, joints have opened, the canopy and water ingress is still a problem, the water brake, though it works amazingly well, still has elements of its system not working. Most of the fasteners holding the engine cover are the wrong ones, there's no ASI, the list is endless but we'll be on it soon as we get a rest and regroup.

Good result, though... and remember, if the BBP did compromise the museum would be displaying a replica and the un-restored wreck would be in Manchester. Don't come asking for compromise now.
I'm only a plumber from Cannock...

"As to reward, my profession is its own reward;" Sherlock Holmes.

'Sometimes you gotta be an S.O.B if you wanna make a dream reality' Mark Knopfler

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